User talk:Eficiente

Welcome to WiKirby!

Hi there Eficiente, and welcome to WiKirby! We hope you'll enjoy editing here; check out our help guide for editing tips and information on do's and don'ts. Also, please keep in mind that all edits are subject to moderation until you become autoconfirmed (5 edits and 24 hours)! If you need any help, just contact one of the administrators. Thanks! — The WiKirby Staff

-- Kirbot (talk) 03:22, 20 March 2024 (UTC)

About your "things I disagree with"

Hi, welcome to the wiki! I really appreciate your contributions so far, but... I feel bad to say it, but immediately I kind of have an issue with your userpage just being a list of your disagreements. You can discuss them on the relevant talk pages if you want — and if you have sources, you're more than welcome to correct misinformation, but granted a lot of it is just speculation in the end. In particular, airing out a disagreement with another user without talking to them feels a bit inappropriate in terms of how to use your userspace. I'd prefer if you could discuss things. (I will say in particular that the games have referred to Dream Land as a kingdom directly multiple times, and that the points about "Dark Meta Knight corrupting Sectonia" and "the breath of humanity" are just speculation that still doesn't confirm anything one way or another.) But I would definitely like the wiki to be as accurate and comprehensive as possible, and I hope we can have you join the discussion. You can join our Discord server if you would like to talk as well. Thank you! StarPunch (talk) 01:51, 28 March 2024 (UTC)

Hello. That's reasonable to say, and I appreciate it. Idk how to say this better, but the thing is that I don't actually came to be part of the wiki, I'm an adult with limited times (relatively) and I more so like to spend my time in other sites, even if I do care about the series itself. So I put my disagreements there because I didn't want to bother to use the talk pages of each topic, which I knew was the proper way to do that. I had little care but I had some care, and that way was faster to give my thoughts out all at once, and keep on doing so in the future. The idea is that if we still disagree, so be it, maybe I'm wrong, and if not then cool. I don't think of it as something inappropriate.

What I actually came to do was to use the Proposals page for a few things of larger scale. And I may do so again in the future, but beyond that I'm probably going to disappear. I only saw this message because I imagined that people would tell me something & I checked, but I don't receive notifications. I also almost never use Discord, bizarre as that may sound.

I don't remember any 1 time that the games referred to Dream Land as a kingdom, and even then I would suspect the Jap. version may not have done the same. But if it has, then I'm wrong. Then again, maybe they follow the narrative of Dedede being a king and therefore are give false information, even if that sounds like it's applying too much dissatisfaction with the info given.

On speculation, it can be something that should not be said when talking about things objectively & in an informative manner, but it can also be equal to something being implied and that should be said when talking about things objectively & in an informative manner. I make sure to use the latter. And as we know, on topics like that it isn't just if the speculation is used or not, but how does the premise look like when we don't. By disagreeing with the possibility of "Dark Meta Knight corrupting Sectonia" with the mirror (or the mirror having leftovers of Dark Mind's corruption over it), then we therefore state as normal at all points in time in Kirby that the Dimension Mirror corrupts those who look at it for too long, because it was stated that it was its power that did that to Sectonia. That should be in its page. And technically, this is not impossible, but I find it logically ridiculous. Especially when it moves on its own to summon Shadow Dedede and suck real Dedede to the Mirror World to fight Dark Meta Knight, as if following the will of others from the other side as they are aware of the events in the real world.

I have no idea how a real physical human and the canonical intentionality behind the worldbuilding referencing how humanity used to be there is still speculation. Idk if you mean something like she being the only human, or if they were all like her but she still isn't human. But I'm good agreeing to disagree. Eficiente (talk) 16:23, 28 March 2024 (UTC-3)

I appreciate the honesty, and I also get where you're coming from. The primary thing to consider here is that, in order to create and vote on proposals, you must be an established contributor to the wiki. You don't necessarily have to be fully invested in it, but being able to help out is a plus. It doesn't take that much time to talk on talk pages and such, even if you don't use Discord (completely understandable, by the way!)

To elaborate a bit on the points I mentioned:

• Japanese text consistently uses the word 国 kuni to describe Dream Land, which can broadly be translated as "country", "land", "world", or "kingdom" (and has been translated as all four at some point). For "kingdom" in particular, the opening of Kirby's Epic Yarn calls it "a kingdom famous for peace and quiet". Dedede doesn't necessarily have to be a real king for the place to be called a kingdom.
• I agree in principle that things can be implied but unstated, and that these can be covered while remaining objective and informative, but I also think that we shouldn't make logical leaps that don't exist in the information we are given. For example, just because we say "Dark Meta Knight didn't corrupt Sectonia" doesn't mean that "every other instance of looking at the mirror causes corruption"; that's a false equivalency. "If [A] is true, then [unrelated point B] must also be true". (It's my theory that Sectonia drove herself to madness and the mirror doesn't actually have any special powers, but that's also not confirmed.)
• For the last point, it's mainly because one, the real physical human doesn't actually appear in the games, and two, the term used in Japanese in that interview (人の息吹, "the breath of humanity") can broadly be taken to refer to as "signs of people" — remnants that a civilization once lived there — rather than literally meaning that humans once lived there. I agree it's likely, but it's not like we can call it canonically confirmed.

I hope that makes sense. I appreciate that you took the time to reply to me! I know you must be deeply invested in these subjects, and I appreciate that you're open to discussion even if you may not have the time to fully devote yourself to it. StarPunch (talk) 20:00, 28 March 2024 (UTC)